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stanz
Advanced Machine Builder
Joined: 15 - April - 2007
 United States
Posts: 871
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| Posted: 06 - February - 2008 at 15:52 | IP Logged
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Nice machine Jim! That's a serious roll cage on the front half. Any thoughts about enclosing it for a full cab? I looks like that's what you were thinking when you built it.
Stan in MA
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jimw
Machine Builder In Training
Joined: 17 - January - 2008
United States
Posts: 22
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| Posted: 06 - February - 2008 at 16:02 | IP Logged
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Stan
Its more for flying branch protection. A 3/16 alum plate roof is in the works
though ! This thing will go places my John Deere 970 4x4 tractor wouldn't
dream of treading ! With the swivel between front and rear halves its
impossible to lift a tire and lose traction. Its 6 feet wide with the wheels
that are on it, very stable on side hills.
Jim
Edited by jimw on 06 - February - 2008 at 16:30
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triptester
Machine Builder
Joined: 19 - February - 2005
United States
Posts: 68
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| Posted: 06 - February - 2008 at 17:35 | IP Logged
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Hey now don't pick on that iron oxide thats the only paint I use.
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METAL MOOSE
Machine Builder In Training
Joined: 09 - January - 2008
Posts: 11
Home Town, State/Province: Whitbourne Newfoundland
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| Posted: 06 - February - 2008 at 18:58 | IP Logged
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anybody got ideas as to how the differential and side axles are set up,or what can be used, wish we had some pics of the working internals of the alstor.
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nylli
Machine Builder
Joined: 09 - March - 2007
 Finland
Posts: 172
Home Town, State/Province: Kallby/Finland
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| Posted: 06 - February - 2008 at 21:21 | IP Logged
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At least one possibility is to use two car rear axels one in front and one in the back
and cutting them to the right length. next step is to make the pivot between the
rear axel and the boogie, then it should work.I haven't figured out all the details yet.
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JoeJ
Sheriff Department
Charter Member
Joined: 24 - December - 2003
United States
Posts: 4954
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 07:04 | IP Logged
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Reviving Nylli's old thread sure brought some interesting machines out of the barn!!
Jim, I'm afraid you opened a can of worms on yourself. We need WAY more pics .
And YES, as Cam said, rust IS a color!!
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JoeJ 
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Murf
Senior Machine Builder
Joined: 30 - June - 2004
 Canada
Posts: 1229
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 07:58 | IP Logged
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A couple of comments in this thread got me thinking again about an idea I tossed around for some time years ago.
A fellow by the name of Emil Gafner (no, really, that was his name!) made an early log skidder along the lines of these machines but with one big difference, the power unit in front was a bone stock Ford farm tractor with the front axle removed. On the back of the rear diff. was a big swivel joint and housing which doubled as both the swivel joint for the rear halfs attachment, and enabled the drive to the rear part of the beast. They also however, made a lot of them which were purely 2WD, the back half being just basically a dedicated trailer.
Even the 2WD models went through some pretty heavy terrain with ease, the combination of huge chained tires and deep gearing made for some pretty astonishing traction.
I was thinking it would be pretty easy to make up something similar, but on a much smaller scale using pretty much standard items. There are for instance lots of old motorcycles going pretty cheap right now, since speed is not required, the gearing could be stepped way down to offer loads of torque and they all have a multi speed gearbox which would give you a nice compact power unit gearbox combo. Maybe transverse mount the engine and chain drive a compact p/u rear end.
Thoughts?
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f350ca
Advanced Machine Builder
Joined: 04 - January - 2004
Posts: 905
Home Town, State/Province: Calabogie Ontario Canada
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 09:47 | IP Logged
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Again along the same lines, have heard of using a farm tractor to pull a trailer made with a truck rear end. The drive shaft was hooked to the pto of the tractor. These were used for hauling pulp wood. When additional traction was needed the pto could be engaged and drive the trailer wheels. Now you'd have to hit the right tractor gear to get everything in sink, but when your moving slow and getting stuck who cares if the trailer is spinning faster or slower than the tractor. At least its helping.
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Greg
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camdigger3
Senior Machine Builder
Joined: 11 - August - 2005
Posts: 1478
Home Town, State/Province: Wimborne, Alberta
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 09:49 | IP Logged
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You make a good point Murf. There are thousands of machines around that are 2wd and articulated. For example, a Cat '31 series scraper has enough traction to haul itself and 30 yards of fill up hills and through bar ditches with power to only the front axle. Check out Farm Show back issues. I'm sure there are examples of tandem or even triple low HP tractors hooked together. The concept should be workable down into the 10 HP range too!
Cam
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twobears
Machine Builder
Joined: 22 - February - 2007
United States
Posts: 135
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 10:43 | IP Logged
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heres what murf is talking about..this iron mule is 4x4 tho.i,ve done alot of research on them and from what i,ve found gafner used mf,ford and ac farm tractors to build them and likes been said the first ones where two wheel front drive.the later ones where 4x4.i,am told there very well liked in the areas where there used alot.
delbert
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Murf
Senior Machine Builder
Joined: 30 - June - 2004
Canada
Posts: 1229
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 10:55 | IP Logged
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That's the beast Delbert!! 
I built a golf course in Florida a few years back and they had one that had been brought down from Georgia, man did it work nice even though it was old as the hills.
I know we use an old Ford 8N for firewood and even with the drag of the non-powered front axle, and a converted politician trailer on the back that old girl will go through snow and rough stuff that challenges the ATV's.
Without the load of the front axle dragging I'm sure it would go nearly anywhere. Besides which the articulated steering would be a huge bonus in terms of both maneuverability and the fact that you could use the diff. lock almost full-time since the rear end would always be going straight forwards.
I'm thinking something about a 500cc should make around 25hp at a reasonable RPM range. Considering how the beast above performs with 14hp I think it would work out just fine. Gear reduced to a compact p/u diff. welded into a locker.
"Honey, I'm going out to the shop for a bit, I'll be back later......" 
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blackdog_006
Advanced Machine Builder
Joined: 12 - December - 2007
United States
Posts: 348
Home Town, State/Province: Chatham Va.
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 14:32 | IP Logged
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The way I could see one of those units being built (if your wanting a massive one) would be with a set of rear ends off of road tractors connected in the center with a swivel joint and a massive drive shaft. The power would come from a standard road tractor engine and tranny connected to the drive line through a gear set similar to what is found on your little 4x4 jeeps. It might be big but if you throw a set of off road tires and chains or a set of tracks on it your never gonna get stuck unless you get into a swamp.
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METAL MOOSE
Machine Builder In Training
Joined: 09 - January - 2008
Posts: 11
Home Town, State/Province: Whitbourne Newfoundland
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 14:55 | IP Logged
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i think i like the idea of a light weight version.lots of bogs around here.
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blackdog_006
Advanced Machine Builder
Joined: 12 - December - 2007
United States
Posts: 348
Home Town, State/Province: Chatham Va.
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 15:09 | IP Logged
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Well it could be light weight we would just need to figure out how to convert a standard pair of 4x4 axles to drive a second axle front and rear basically in the same manner as before but with allot more work.
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glyford
Advanced Machine Builder
Joined: 19 - April - 2006
United States
Posts: 334
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 15:13 | IP Logged
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Look at FWD or Oshkosh trucks, most are 4wd with a transfercase. Of course, depending on what you want to haul, it might just be easiest to leave the truck in one piece and just drive it into the woods.
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blackdog_006
Advanced Machine Builder
Joined: 12 - December - 2007
United States
Posts: 348
Home Town, State/Province: Chatham Va.
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 15:18 | IP Logged
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I found this just now when I went searching for an axle conversion kit most of the conversions were done for show which is dumber than using a jack hammer to drive a finish nail in pine. But I half to admit the truck they converted for towing trailers is rather neat since the axle combinations is good for 20K LBS total payload
http://www.usa6x6.com
Edited by blackdog_006 on 07 - February - 2008 at 15:26
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Doug
Advanced Machine Builder
Joined: 30 - September - 2006
United States
Posts: 288
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 15:52 | IP Logged
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Jim, as Joe said way more pixs. Please keep him happy for all our sakes. What did you use for axles.
Doug
Edited by Doug on 07 - February - 2008 at 15:56
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jimw
Machine Builder In Training
Joined: 17 - January - 2008
United States
Posts: 22
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| Posted: 07 - February - 2008 at 16:19 | IP Logged
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Doug
Will try and get some more pics next time i have it outside, right now its in the
shop and its hard to take pictures. I used all Jeep parts, front end, rear etc.
Steering knuckle is from an earlier Jeep, if i were to do it over i might look
for a knuckle off an 8 lug 3/4 or 1 ton. This is a shot of the rear hoist,
same dimensions as my John Deere 3pt arms. With the tail gate out it lies
down flat in the bed, winch lifts out of a vertical square tube reciever.
Was thinking it would be a good place to put a gooseneck for a trailer
to pull logs. Pics also show the reversed 700x20 tires and wheels, makes
for a nice wide track and lots of ground clearance !
Jim
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twobears
Machine Builder
Joined: 22 - February - 2007
United States
Posts: 135
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| Posted: 09 - February - 2008 at 21:22 | IP Logged
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i,ve skidded alot of logs and hauled alot of firewood with two wheel drive farm tractors.i have noticed the front tires will get you in trouble alot and they really don,t steer all that well in the woods.
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blackdog_006
Advanced Machine Builder
Joined: 12 - December - 2007
United States
Posts: 348
Home Town, State/Province: Chatham Va.
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| Posted: 09 - February - 2008 at 21:39 | IP Logged
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Its fascinating watching a newer Prentice feller buncher and a skidder making short work of a forest. Now if there were only some we could build a mini skidder with a hydraulic grapple for dragging out firewood.
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Topic: A little 8 wheeler
